 Business of Joint Committee.  UN Fact-Finding Mission on the Gaza Conflict: Discussion of Goldstone Report.
Chairman:   This meeting has been called to discuss the Report of the United Nations Fact- + Deputy Alan Shatter: I am sorry to interrupt. Before the Chairman welcomes Colonel Travers, I want +++++++ Senator David Norris: Deputy Shatter is now getting to the meat of the debate. Deputy Alan Shatter: If Senator Norris could contain himself. Senator David Norris: Deputy Shatter is frustrating the work of the committee. Deputy Alan Shatter: I am not getting to the meat of anything. Chairman: Deputy Shatter, you have made your point. Deputy Alan Shatter: No, I have not made this point. I insist I make it because it will take me + Senator Mark Daly: Chairman, could I interject? Did the committee secretariat receive any item + Deputy Alan Shatter: Has Senator Daly read the 500-page report? Senator Mark Daly: Deputy Shatter is on about a procedural issue. Deputy Rory O’Hanlon: Chairman, could we hear Colonel Travers without fear or favour and then hear + Deputy Alan Shatter: I will not——- Senator Mark Daly: Did Deputy Shatter contact the committee secretariat about his concerns? Deputy Alan Shatter: The committee should not go through the usual route of set piece speeches on a + Senator Mark Daly: Did Deputy Shatter contact the committee secretariat about his concerns on + Deputy Alan Shatter: My office would have telephoned the secretariat looking for bound copies of + Chairman: I understand Deputy Shatter asked for a hard copy of the report which was not + Deputy Alan Shatter: Can I complete my point? Chairman: We will allow Deputy Shatter to finish his point. Deputy Alan Shatter: The final matter I want to raise, which I had started before Senator Norris got + Senator David Norris: Deputy Shatter does not unduly excite me. (Interruptions). Deputy Alan Shatter: It is a great relief to hear that; the feeling is mutual. In the ninth special + Senator Mark Daly: Can I make a point—— Chairman: I propose to proceed—— Deputy Alan Shatter: I am sorry if I am upsetting members but I am merely making the point that the + Senator Mark Daly: I asked Colonel Travers to attend the committee. I did not ask him to bring + Deputy Alan Shatter: Did Senator Daly read the report? Senator Mark Daly: I read the report. It was tedious reading. Deputy Alan Shatter: Did the Senator read the protocol? Senator Mark Daly: I did not ask him—— Deputy Alan Shatter: Has the Senator read the report? (Interruptions). Senator David Norris: Chairman, there is much hectoring going on. Can we hear Colonel Travers and + Senator Mark Daly: If Deputy Shatter wants to propose a motion, let him do so as it is a free + Deputy Billy Timmins: On a point of order, Chairman. I indicated I wish to speak and you called me. ++ Senator David Norris: Hear, hear. Deputy Billy Timmins: ——and then we can squabble in private session. Chairman: We will proceed on that basis. Deputy Michael D. Higgins: Can I speak briefly? Chairman: Briefly, please. Deputy Michael D. Higgins: I can be very brief. (Interruptions). Deputy Michael D. Higgins: I believe we should take advantage of the presence of Colonel Travers and hear + Senator David Norris: And the Israeli Embassy. Deputy Michael D. Higgins: I have been a member of this committee for a long time. I respect + Senator David Norris: Hear, hear. Deputy Michael D. Higgins: I wish we could all come to the committee and give our contributions based on + Senator David Norris: Well said. Chairman: We will now proceed and I apologise to Colonel Travers for this situation. Deputy Alan Shatter: May I ask that the motion passed by the UN Human Rights Council be circulated + Chairman: Of course it can. Deputy Rory O’Hanlon: We have been at this for 20 minutes now. Deputy Michael D. Higgins: If any other member of the committee has any other evidence of any kind, terms + Chairman: That is agreed. As Colonel Travers can see, this is an issue in which the + Colonel Desmond Travers: A dhaoine uaisle, baill an Chomhchoiste Um Ghnóthaí Eachtracha, ++++++++++ Chairman: I thank Colonel Travers and call Deputy Billy Timmins. Deputy Billy Timmins: I thank Colonel Travers very much for his remarks. The committee would love to + Chairman: Unless members are seeking particular points of clarification now we can have a + Deputy Billy Timmins: Colonel Travers has indicated that he is willing to come back, and we should + Deputy Michael D. Higgins: I thank the colonel for his presentation, and for the offer to come back when ++ Deputy Rory O’Hanlon: I thank the colonel for coming in. Like Deputy Timmins, I would like to hear ++ Chairman: I echo what Deputy Higgins said. There is urgency coming into winter as 40,000 ++ Senator David Norris: I will contribute briefly, because there is a vote in the Seanad and I will ++ Colonel Desmond Travers: He is not immune. He has been accused of being a Jew-hating Israeli. Senator David Norris: I apologise, but if I do not appear for the vote, I will be accused of being at + Chairman: We do not really mind if the Senator misses the vote. He is on the Opposition + Colonel Desmond Travers: I thank Deputy Timmins for his comments. I will take Deputy Higgins’s +++++++++ Deputy Seán Ardagh: I thank Colonel Travers for attending and for his presentation. I am concerned +++ Chairman: I draw the attention of members to the fact that in addition to the briefing + Deputy Alan Shatter: Like everyone else, I am sorry if we delayed Colonel Travers’s start but ++++++++++ Deputy Michael D. Higgins: They were used in Falluja. Deputy Alan Shatter: Would it be true to state that this conflict has thrown up effects of these + Chairman: In conclusion, I call Colonel Travers. Colonel Desmond Travers: If Deputy Shatter does not mind, I must take the questions in sequence. I ++++++++ Deputy Alan Shatter: Does the colonel think that the terms of that motion coloured the Israeli + Colonel Desmond Travers: |