Financial Resolutions, 1978: Financial Statement, Budget, 1978. - Deputy Dr. Browne rose.

Wednesday, 1 February 1978

Dáil Eireann Debate
Vol. 303 No. 2

First Page Previous Page Page of 129 Next Page Last Page

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  I cannot call Deputy Browne. The Rules of the House and the Standing Orders allow for short statements from a spokesman for each Opposition party. The number of the Standing Order is 38 and it is covered by precedent and by rulings of the Chair down the years. I am sorry, Deputy Browne, but you will be called in the debate tomorrow or during the coming weeks.

Dr. Browne: Information on Noel C. Browne  Zoom on Noel C. Browne  I should like to point out that there is precedent for an Independent Deputy.

[447]An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  There is no precedent for an Independent Deputy. The Standing Order states that it must be a party or group recognised by the House and that Standing Order has been carried out by the Chair down the years. I would ask Deputy Browne to resume his seat.

Dr. Browne: Information on Noel C. Browne  Zoom on Noel C. Browne  Is it not improper that a Deputy should find himself voting against a measure and that he should not be in a position to inform his——

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  The vote is on the resolution if the House wants it.

Dr. Browne: Information on Noel C. Browne  Zoom on Noel C. Browne  There will be a vote?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  As I understand it, last year the general Financial Resolution was put to the House and voted on. The budget debate was on a motion put down the following day to take note of the Financial Statement. If Deputies want it that way they can have it but otherwise there will be no vote this evening.

Mr. P. Barry: Information on Peter Barry  Zoom on Peter Barry  I am not clear as to what will happen. My memory tells me, although I am not sure, that a vote took place last year.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  There was a vote because the House agreed to accept the general Financial Resolution which concludes the budget and to debate a motion to take note of the Financial Statement later. That motion was put down the following day by the then Parliamentary Secretary to the Taoiseach.

Mr. P. Barry: Information on Peter Barry  Zoom on Peter Barry  What was the vote on?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  It is not necessary that we have a vote this evening and the House can proceed to debate the general resolution for weeks and have a vote at the end of it.

Mr. Cluskey: Information on Frank Cluskey  Zoom on Frank Cluskey  If one was to accept this general Financial Resolution without a vote would that imply that one agreed with all the provisions in the budget?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  No. The position is that the general Financial [448] Resolution is for debate. There cannot be a vote on the Financial Statement of the Minister for Finance but there can be a vote at the end of the debate on the general Financial Resolution. We can do what the House did last year, by agreement. If the House wishes to have a vote tonight we can have one on the general Financial Resolution and the debate will hinge on a motion to be put down tomorrow to take note of the Financial Statement.

Dr. Browne: Information on Noel C. Browne  Zoom on Noel C. Browne  I am sorry to trouble the Chair but I should like to know if I am not to be allowed make a statement if the vote is called?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  It is a matter for the House. If the Opposition parties want a vote this evening it must be on the general Financial Resolution.

Mr. Cluskey: Information on Frank Cluskey  Zoom on Frank Cluskey  Will the Chair put the general Financial Resolution?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  I must put that general resolution but I can only put it by agreement of the House. The debate on the budget will then hinge on a motion to be put down tomorrow.

Mr. T. J. Fitzpatrick: Information on Thomas J. Fitzpatrick  Zoom on Thomas J. Fitzpatrick  (Cavan-Monaghan): That is the normal procedure.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  It is what happened last year but it is not the normal procedure.

Mr. Cluskey: Information on Frank Cluskey  Zoom on Frank Cluskey  The only way to find out if we want a vote or not is to put the resolution.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  I cannot put the resolution unless the House wants to vote on it and unless Deputies are prepared to accept what I have stated, that the debate will be on a motion to be put down afterwards, as happened last year.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley  Zoom on George Colley  If the Chair puts the resolution now then it is open to the House to decide whether or not it wishes to vote on it. The resolution will be disposed of one way or the other then. In order to ensure that we [449] can debate the budget the Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach will put down a motion in the same terms as the one we debated last year. That will enable the debate to take place, starting tomorrow morning.

Mr. P. Barry: Information on Peter Barry  Zoom on Peter Barry  What is the alternative if we do not have a vote? Is it not true that the debate starts anyway?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  This resolution can be left until tomorrow and the House can have the whole debate on it or the House can decide it this evening and have the debate on a motion to be put down to take note of the budget statement.

Mr. T. J. Fitzpatrick: Information on Thomas J. Fitzpatrick  Zoom on Thomas J. Fitzpatrick  (Cavan-Monaghan): The Minister for Finance is suggesting that this general resolution be put now and when that is disposed of he is undertaking to put down a motion tomorrow morning that will enable the debate on the budget to take place.

Mr. Cluskey: Information on Frank Cluskey  Zoom on Frank Cluskey  Can we have an indication, in broad terms, of the terms of the motion to be put down tomorrow?

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley  Zoom on George Colley  Just to take note of the Financial Statement.

Dr. Browne: Information on Noel C. Browne  Zoom on Noel C. Browne  Does this still preclude me from making a speech now?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  We cannot have any more speeches this evening. They are out at this stage, even before we take a vote, according to the rules of the House. That has always been the position.

Mr. M.P. Murphy: Information on Michael Pat Murphy  Zoom on Michael Pat Murphy  If the resolution is to be put now can we not address ourselves to that resolution?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  We cannot have a debate this evening. If the House wishes to debate the resolution we must wait until tomorrow.

Mr. M.P. Murphy: Information on Michael Pat Murphy  Zoom on Michael Pat Murphy  Can we make comments when discussing the Financial Resolutions?

Mr. Haughey: Information on Charles J. Haughey  Zoom on Charles J. Haughey  That only occurs when there are specific Financial Resolutions.

[450]An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  There is only the general Financial Resolution. In 1976 we had six or seven Financial Resolutions and we had votes on most of them. Last year it was similar to this year in that we had only the general Financial Resolution. The House then was anxious for a division on that general resolution and the agreement was that the debate on the budget would follow on a motion to be put down by the then Parliamentary Secretary to the Taoiseach. If that is not what the House wants this year we will go ahead with the other business ordered.

Mr. M.P. Murphy: Information on Michael Pat Murphy  Zoom on Michael Pat Murphy  I should like the Minister for Health to tell the House why the Minister for Finance forgot about fisheries in the budget statement because Fianna Fáil were very emotive about fisheries?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  I understand that the Whips have agreed to this procedure. The Leader of the Labour Party has suggested that the motion be put and I would be obliged if the Leader of the Fine Gael Party would give the House his views on the matter.

Dr. FitzGerald: Information on Garrett Fitzgerald  Zoom on Garrett Fitzgerald  It seems to me that the normal procedure is to put the resolution. I would have thought we would be entitled, when the resolution is put, to state briefly the reason for the vote.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  That is in relation to the budget debate which follows. That has always been the position; I am not making any new rules. I am doing what was carried out last year and in previous years when we were in this position.

Dr. FitzGerald: Information on Garrett Fitzgerald  Zoom on Garrett Fitzgerald  The best thing is to put the resolution and if we cannot give our reasons to the House we have other means of communicating with the people our reasons for opposing this budget.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley  Zoom on George Colley  The Opposition parties will not exactly be gagged tomorrow in the House.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Information on Seán Browne  Zoom on Seán Browne  The budget debate can go on for weeks and [451] Deputies know that. The Minister for Finance should move the resolution.


Last Updated: 14/09/2010 15:43:02 First Page Previous Page Page of 129 Next Page Last Page