Ross, Shane Peter NathanielTuesday, 22 April 1997 |
Seanad Éireann Debate
Page of 13
|
Universities Bill, 1996: Committee Stage (Resumed).
I explained my problem with this section of the debate on an earlier amendment. I want to ask the Minister a couple of questions. Why is it necessary to provide for the object of a university in legi...
That does not quite answer my question but it takes me some way down the road. Does that mean the Minister and the Government do not have a role in this section?
In that case, if a Minister decides at a future date that a university is not promoting what the Minister considers to be the highest standards in the quality of teaching and research — for instance, ...
I am well aware of that and do not need to be told. I want a categorical assurance from the Minister that there will be no Government enforcement of this section. I want to know if the Minister mean...
My objections to this section are similar to those I expressed on the previous section. In both cases a kind of wish list for universities is being put forward. We are being offered the current and ...
The Minister and I may disagree on everything but that is not a tragedy. Senator Cotter said this section would not hurt or affect anyone in any particular way and there is a certain amount of truth ...
We have the right to legislate on anything. However, I do not know whether we have the competence to legislate. I would like to see less legislation on matters such as this. This Bill should have be...
However, the House has the right to do so. We should give autonomy to people to regulate their own affairs where they have greater expertise.
I understand the Minister's point and we will not agree on the philosophy of the matter. Will the Minister answer my question on why it is necessary to include the minor matter of collaborating with a...
I did not ask for it.
I asked a specific question about paragraph (f). I do not care two hoots about this House's support for what I say. I have a right to ask the Minister a question. It does not do any good for the Mi...
No it is not. I asked a specific question——
I asked a specific question about a paragraph to which the Minister persistently refuses to reply. It is a simple question. Why is the paragraph there? I am entitled to an answer. Committee Stage i...
The Minister must give me a simple reply.
No. I want a specific reply. Question put and declared carried. Section 14 agreed to. SECTION 15.
I move amendment No. 31: In page 12, subsection (1), lines 40 and 41, to delete “being not less than 20 or more than 38, as determined in accordance with this Chapter” and substitute “as determined by...
I wish to clarify a number of extraordinary misapprehensions which I can only conclude are deliberate.
I am not surprised at the amazing leap to the defence of county councillors. Nobody declared an interest when they did so but most Members of the House are elected by county councillors. Perhaps it ...
Declarations of interests are relevant.
That is correct but it is relevant to the debate. Unlike Senator Manning I was elected to a county council. However, I do not think that, as a county councillor, I should be put on the board of a u...
I was elected for a purpose and I did not at any stage declare an interest in becoming a member of a board of a university as a county councillor. When I put my name before the people in the local el...
I was elected for an area, like Senator Fitzgerald. However, that does not give me any right to do anything else. If I was promoted to another position, I would have a political agenda. I would rep...
——but not as politicians on bodies of which they have no business being members. Everybody knows that is what I meant and anybody who pretends otherwise is flying a flag to an electorate which they ho...
It is time this type of proposal did not provoke a phoney political row purely for electoral purposes.
I did not say that.
I move amendment No. 38: In page 13, subsection (3), lines 31 to 39, to delete paragraph (a).
I reserve the right to put down an amendment on Report Stage. There is a misunderstanding which is probably my fault. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
I move amendment No. 43: In page 14, subsection (3) (c), line 6, to delete “shall” and substitute “may”. This is the crux of the Bill and is particularly difficult to accept. If this provision is ena...
Senator Norris did not say that; I did and I stand by it.
The Minister did not reply to the points made but said that she might have one or no nominee, which is precisely the point. The Minister did not justify why the nominees need to be there. We are ent...
She is being told to giggle. Why should the Minister have a nominee on the board of Dublin University for the first time? Is there a particular reason why Dublin University deserves this surveillanc...
The appointments on the formation of the Government in 1992 were disgraceful and well documented. Two Ministerial appointments were recently made in Senator Sherlock's constituency to the board of Bor...
That is outrageous. I am sure there is a rational case for that power but I want the Minister to give us the reasons why it is necessary. It is an innovation for at least one university. Maybe it is ...
I did not mention county councillors.
I cannot withdraw something I did not say, but I understand the affection of Members for county councillors. I understand Senator Ormonde's outrage and it will be good for her in her constituency whe...
The analogy is totally incorrect because people go onto boards with the consent of that board.
Vótáil.
I come in stoutly behind the Minister on this amendment. It is a refreshing experience for me and it may convince the Minister she is wrong. It is probably Senator Lee's best chance of his amendment...
I move amendment No. 52: In page 14, subsection (5) (b), lines 43 and 44, to delete subparagraphs (i) and (ii). I agree with the Chair's ruling, even though I have not yet come to grips with it. I un...
Senator Manning.
I apologise if I am in breach of the rules of the House. Amendment No. 52 returns to our old friend, the Lord Mayor of Cork, to whom we referred a short time ago. The Lord Mayor of Cork was recently...
It is more than one could say about the Lord Mayor of Waterford, with whom I am not familiar. It is absurd that people are being appointed to the boards of universities by virtue of the fact that the...
I am an elected county councillor.
That is correct.
I understand the eagerness to curtail the discussion on this matter. However, Members should congratulate and thank me for giving them an opportunity to speak to their electorate. Most of them have ...
One of the amendments addresses the position of lords mayor. I am a county councillor and it is fair to say that I have been involved in certain deals and agreements of which I am not proud. One of ...
Everybody knows that is the case.
They are divided proportionally among the political parties. That is the truth. There is no university in Wicklow, but if the chairman of Wicklow County Council was in the same position as the lords ...
It is time we told the truth about this and I make no apology for saying it. I admit I have participated in a deal of that sort and it is not something of which I am proud.
That is the political system within which we work and one of the reforms which is necessary. Senator Cregan is right — I am not always consistent, nor is anyone in this House. Like everyone else, I s...
I am a political crony and I should not be on the board of a university by virtue of that. Senator Lydon took great advantage of this debate to name two of his constituents and say they were wonderfu...
It does not have a good chance of being accepted.
On a point of order, will there be an amendment on Report Stage similar to amendment No. 57?
The purpose of amendment No. 68 is to give the governing authority a power which the Minister seems to have taken upon herself. It addresses the subject of those who are nominated by organisations re...
I thank the Minister for clarifying that. However, why should it be in the opinion of the Minister that they are representative of business or industry rather than that of the governing authority? T...
I do not think we will reach any agreement on that. What does the Minister mean by the term “business”?
I am not trying to be awkward but I have a difficulty every day with how wide that sphere extends. That is very important because this clause will include or exclude certain types of people. What ex...
I move amendment No. 69: In page 16, subsection (10), line 22, delete “or approved by the Minister” and substitute “or approved by the governing authority”.
I move amendment No. 69a: In page 16, subsection (3), line 43, to delete “vote of not less than two-thirds”. Section 16(3) states: Where the governing authority decides at a meeting that a person othe...
I understand that the Minister feels strongly about this but I still fail to understand why a majority of two-thirds is necessary. The purpose of my amendment is to ensure that this is done by a majo...
I move amendment No. 80a: In page 18, subsection (6), between lines 22 and 23, to insert the following new paragraph: “(d) to promote good relations between people of all religions on the island of Ir...
Thank you. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn. Section 17 agreed to. NEW SECTIONS.
I am slightly concerned by the appointment of a judge as a visitor and I would not like this to go by without comment. We tend to assume that judges are people who, for some reason, are a cut above t...
I record my opposition to this section.
| Last Updated: 21/05/2011 04:47:30 |
Page of 13
|